Rogan refutes ‘biased bull$#!^’ in Vice story
Joe Rogan: “I’m 100% in favor of transgender people, but to pretend that a male frame and a female frame are the same is insane.”
Transgender blogger Parker Marie Molloy recently blasted UFC color commentator Joe Rogan over remarks he made about transgener WMMA fighter Fallon Fox.
“She wants to be able to fight women in MMA; I say no f—ing way,” Rogan is quoted as saying on his podcast. “I say if you had a dick at one point in time, you also have all the bone structure that comes with having a dick. You have bigger hands, you have bigger shoulder joints. You’re a f—ing man. That’s a man, OK?”
“Fight guys, yes. She has to fight guys. First of all, she’s not really a she. She’s a transgender, post-op person. The operation doesn’t shave down your bone density. It doesn’t change. You look at a man’s hands and you look at a women’s hands and they’re built different. They’re just thicker, they’re stronger, your wrists are thicker, your elbows are thicker, your joints are thicker. Just the mechanical function of punching, a man can do it much harder than a woman can, period.”
Molloy accused Rogan of “weaving back and forth between ignorance and bigotry” and “flat-out personal attacks and pseudo-science” and being a “washed up stand-up comedian.” While there is much that is commendable about Molloy’s blog, ironically, it could reasonably be accused of weaving back and forth between flat-out personal attacks and pseudo-science.
Rogan mounted a vigorous defense, via Twitter.
Joe Rogan @joerogan
•Hey @VICE you’re putting up biased bulls— about trans athletes fighting in MMA. An unbiased doctor’s take on it.
•Here’s the offending @VICE piece
•For the record, I’m 100% in favor of people doing whatever the f— they want. I’m 100% in favor of transgender people, but to pretend that a male frame and a female frame are the same is insane. If a woman knows that someone she’s competing with was born male and chooses to fight her anyway, I’m 100% in favor of that as well. The idea that you women because it’s a “private medical history issue” is what I find most offensive about the fighter in question. She fought women without letting them know she used to be a man, and I’m 100% against that. combat sports are unique in terms of trans athletes because the goal is to damage your opponent and the male frame is advantageous for it.
•Folks, please leave @ParkerMolloy alone or at the very least be kind & civil in your interaction. We can all debate without being s—-y.
The piece that Rogan cited above was an interview that Stephie Daniels conducted with board-certified endocrinologist Dr. Ramona Krutzik, about the possible advantages Fallon Fox may have. These centered on:
Bone Density
Muscle Mass
Imprinting
Dr. Krutzik did not speak in absolutes, or discuss whether Fallon Fox should be licensed to fight, or offer any personal opinion at all. Instead she answered questioned about the science.
Fallon Fox is a controversial figure. Like any professional fighter, she knows the more people are talking about her, the better she will do in terms of getting fights. Further, she is a fighter, and instinctively answers fire with fire.
That said, please keep the debate civil. This is a question of science. Does the science show that male to female transgender athletes have no significant biological advantage that would be beneficial in a fight?
In 1976, trans tennis player Dr. Reneé Richards was granted the right to compete as a woman by the New York Supreme Court. She didn’t make it past the first round of the 1977 U.S. Open. Fighting of course is different. If you lose in Tennis it is whatever to love. If you lose in mixed martial arts, it’s your ass. So the greatest attention possible needs to be focused on the science.
The question is not even that complex. Do male to female transgender athletes have a physiological advantage outside the variation that is found in the cisgender female population? So women are stronger than others. Some women have denser bones that others. Some women are more aggressive than others. The question is, does being a male to female transgender athlete confer advantages that are outside the scope of variation that naturally occurs?
Making bigoted remarks about Fox is the polar opposite of what needs to happen, so please don’t. Further, the women who take a fight with Fox do so knowing that she was born a man, and remained a man into her adulthood. Ashlee Evans Smith, who has a combined pro/am record of 5-3, knew Fox’s background, and knocked her out on the 3rd.
Like Rogan said “we can all debate without being s—-y.”